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I'm being very polite!
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mcdangle....how did I know that would come winging in!! and a damn fine unit too.
Bob

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I agree with everything that is being said here. However, barely six weeks have passed since the Ministerial Statement and, as George points out, we've still got a lot of work to do on the papers that we have. Those papers, like the Cabinet Office letter to me, provide us with the ammunition we need and we're working on them as fast as we can. Before taking any irrevocable action in relation to tactical complaints, I'd like a little more time to do two things:

1. Obtain answers to our questions. The questions are simple (I'll post my submission today ... I've been meaning to do that for some time). They require simple answers which should not take a long to produce. If there is any prevarication on the part of other parties, then we can implement our contingency plans. But until we have given people time to respond, our contingency plans will not have any bite. We shall be seen to be jumping the gun and people will ask 'why?'. Which brings me to the second thing I'd like to do ...

2. Increase our support base. Many potential supporters, particularly those with influence, will be put off supporting us unless we demonstrate that we are a stable group that is in the process of exhausting all conventional means to illicit answers to our questions before tackling HMG, the Queen and the HD Committee on some very serious issues. Whatever our feelings, they have the right to be given time to answer.

The Fight4thePJM campaign is fuelled and maintained by people following fairly conventional lines of attack - we are a bunch of ex-servicemen who know they have been exploited by HMG and so have a legitimate case to put. I want people to see us for what we are - it is a very telling and appealling profile and one I would not wish to prematurely alter.

PS I repeat my earlier PS ... We must each do what we think is best - as individuals, not purporting to be acting for this or any other group. Hence my statement that these are purely my personal views and I do not purport to reflect the opinions of others not to act for them.


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BarryF, who fought for the Right to Wear the Pingat Jasa Malaysia
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Barry,
...that most recent post of yours is nothing but the voice of reason speaking!

Flailing about, uttering all manner of (potentially) idle threats will acheive nothing...we must 'keep our act together'!!


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...................'Jock'
Paroi...Rasah...Batu Signals Troop.
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Post Race Relations 
I have to agree with Barry on this one. It might be that we could take action citong racial discrimination if all else fails, but that will be a lengthy and costly procedure. I doubt that we would get any lawyer to help us other than to charge a huge fee just to tell us that we really have no case. It's a strategy that we need to keep in the ammo locker. For the time being I think that lobbying and publicity is the way forward, although it might not hurt if a letter to an MP, etc, contains a few words along the lines of "I do feel that the British veterans have been discriminated in this matter". That leaves the exact interpretation open to the recipient without opening the Pandora's box of litigation.
GerryL


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Gerald Law (ex RAF Borneo Veteran)
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Post Hands Up 
I think I was the one who started the race relations and discrimination thing but I did it genuinely to elicit discussion and not to suggest that we actually take action on this subject immediately. I put my hands up and agree with all that has been said in that jumping on to a new subject when there are those who already have a plan of action is somewhat premature but I would really like 'them' to know that we feel discriminated against. Thanks to everyone for their efforts to calm me down. I will now draw in my horns and shout at the telly when Blair or his banana skin politicians are on. BUT, when I get my PJM and wear it, I will still threaten the buggers with the law of our land if they interfere with me in any way.

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Post Re: Hands Up 
mcdangle wrote:
I will now draw in my horns


I hope you don't! All that has been said represents the pent up frustration of we who have been rogered by some insensitive bureaucrats. Nothing has been said that I take exception to. And I think that applies to everyone else, too.

If anybody is feeling a bit jaded, herewith my two stage suggestion to get fizzed up again:

1. Let them read George's post in this Forum a few above this one entitled Letter from Cabinet Office. It sickened me when I received it and sickens me now. It sickens many Malaysians. It is contemptuous in the extreme of what we did and of Malaysian dignity and feelings. The full letter is at http://www.fight4thepjm.org/the_pjm_cabinet_office_letter_1.htm

2. Then read the MOD Medal Office "Nothing to do with us ... but don't you dare wear it" letter that George sent in. Read the opening sentence and then the last sentence. Then picture that letter being sent to a widow ... then get angry again. That letter is at http://www.fight4thepjm.org/whatwesay_mod_not_us.htm.

Those letters explain why nothing has changed. We are keeping our powder dry but if those in the shadowy corridors of power do not respond, then we'll invoke our contingency plans and it really will hit the fan.


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BarryF, who fought for the Right to Wear the Pingat Jasa Malaysia
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George F wrote:
One important fact to remember regards before even thinking about a discrimation case, is that the individual must have first received the PJM medal and secondly received a personal letter from the MOD ordering that person they are forbidden to wear the medal. Without such evidence you have no case to begin with.

I WILL wait untill I receive MY PJM medals, and THAT little letter from the MOD. Remembering if the letter is only an MOD flyer with no signature on it, the MOD can deny sending it. The MOD have their own legal advisors and can be very deceptive and sneaky when it comes to sending private citizens personal letters.

IF THE LETTER YOU RECEIVE WITH YOUR MEDAL IS NOT SIGNED THEN IT IS NOT AN OFFICIAL LETTER.


I think George has hit the nail on the head here and yes I'm BLOODY ANGRY! Evil or Very Mad


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Post Re: Hands Up 
George F wrote:

THANK YOU BARRY FOR HIGHLIGHTING THIS DECEITFUL MOD UNOFFICIAL INSULTING LETTER

My 'pleasure', George.

And a small pressie to you - a piccie of your favourite peeress! Hope you like it as much as she does. Cheers! Barry.

(Grab your Valium and then click here: http://www.fight4thepjm.org/the_pjm_acceptance_br.htm)


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BarryF, who fought for the Right to Wear the Pingat Jasa Malaysia
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Thanks Barry, for the reference...This extract caught my eye...

"
Quote:
Last month the Prime Minister announced that Symons will be his special representative in the Middle East and Africa. She will be negotiating so-called Memorandum of Understanding agreements with several countries, such as Jordan and Libya, that will endeavour to ensure that terror suspects sent back to their home countries will not be tortured or executed."

....Given the Baroness' demonstrated propensity for instant and erroneous decision, coupled with her total disdain for pertinent topical research, one now has every confidence that all 'suspects' affected will be both... tortured AND executed, after, no doubt, being summarily rejected as ineligible for protection under the 'Memorandum of Understanding agreements'.


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...................'Jock'
Paroi...Rasah...Batu Signals Troop.
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JOHN MATE, I'VE JUST POSTED " TELL IT LIKE IT IS ", THOUGHT I WAS ALONE, READ YOUR POSTINGS, KEEP IT UP , THATS WHAT WE NEED,I THOUGHT I WAS JUST GETTING OLD AND CYNICAL, THO MY INTENTION IS TO KEEP A SENSE OF HUMOUR ! WONDERFUL STUFF!

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Post Roger that! 
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MY INTENTION IS TO KEEP A SENSE OF HUMOUR ! WONDERFUL STUFF!


ro5=6372...now THAT's a handle!!

Welcome aboard...and remember...the one thing that pompous authority simply cannot stand...is being laughed at!


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...................'Jock'
Paroi...Rasah...Batu Signals Troop.
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I've caught up with most of what I have missed in the past 10 days, so can I recommend that we turn the heat back up to Gas Mark 5, I really believe that someone is running scared, now lets keep the eejits running. Let them have their little tete-a-tete each morning at 0900hrs in the Committee Room of the HD, let them send an Army General or an Air Vice Marshal into the fray saying 'toodle pip wear what you want' because NONE of US are giving up this fight PERIOD. I think we ought to give this HD Committee a deadline before we really start to get angry, what say you guys.

To the HD Committee:- we will accept your surrender on our terms, so we will be magmaninous in your defeat you have our word for it.......

I have a lot of newbies on my forum Barry so have bumped up the PJM


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John Cooper wrote:
I have a lot of newbies on my forum Barry so have bumped up the PJM


Hi John,

Yes, I spotted how you are keeping our profile up on your web site. I've visited and left a message. Thanks for pointing them to us. I hope they will take an interest and register. Barry

PS Others who have not visited this web site should have a look - it's fascinating, lively and of great interest:

http://www.activeboard.com/forum.spark?forumID=46291&subForumID=167085&commentID=5678105&action=viewTopic&commentPage=&topicPage=

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Post AFFAIR 
I see that a government minister has admitted to having an affair with his secretary!

LOOKS LIKE WE ARE NOT THE ONLY ONES WHO ARE BEING SCREWED.

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Post Re: AFFAIR 
Paul Alders wrote:
I see that a government minister has admitted to having an affair with his secretary!

LOOKS LIKE WE ARE NOT THE ONLY ONES WHO ARE BEING SCREWED.


Perhaps you would like to send Mr Prescott an email to that effect Paul

lgfweb@odpm.gsi.gov.uk


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