It is said that the eight members of the HD Committee created the discredited PJM recommendation having received pan-Departmental advice and Ministerial input, and that they put their recommendation to the Queen (to whom they are solely responsible) and after due thought She approved it.

Sounds good - even 'constitutional' - but is it? Oddly, we don't think so.

After 1 1/2 years of correspondence with the parties involved, we now know that this PJM recommendation emerged from the desks of three key civil servants:

1. Mr Denis Brennan is the key civil servant. He is the Ceremonial Officer of the Cabinet Office (Secretary) and is pivotal in all this.

2. Then there Chris Edge who is the Honours Secretary at the Foreign and Commonwealth Office (who are ultimately responsible for Foreign awards). He will draft most of the letters you receive no matter who apparently signs them.

3. Then there is Richard Coney who drafts just about everything that emerges on the subject from the Ministry of Defence.

The majority of my letters, no matter to whom I address them (including those written to Ministers and to members of the HD Committee) are replied to by one of these three civil servants.

The raw conclusion, therefore, is that it is these three men who are in control of your rights ... your right to wear the PJM. Not the HD Committee, not Ministers, not your MP, not even the Queen.

What they say goes. They have absolute power in a democratic country - but are answerable to nobody. Clearly, we need to examine how that power is exercised - and we shall do that on this section of the Forum.

When posting your thoughts, please be ‘civil’ - we have been told by civil servants on many occasions that unless we are 'civil' to them they are not obliged to reply! Honestly - we have that in writing …as we have so much else that in due course will be exposed here.

Anyway, let's get started ...


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BarryF, who fought for the Right to Wear the Pingat Jasa Malaysia

We are not about to get pompous about civil servants and the PJM - but we are not the only ones to be worried about the power that civil servants wield in our supposed democracy.

The matter has been raised even by Tony Blair (but he wasn't that concerned when it suited him to have civil servants draft his decision to allegedly illegally invade Iraq). But if the PM is worried - we should be too.

And that is why the Civil Service is being under the microscope by Parliament. There is an enquiry going on about the reform of the civil service. One of our staunch supportes, ex-Home Secretary David Blunkett MP, has kindly sent us his evidence to the Public Administration Select Committee.

Please note that he makes reference to "non-Department Public Bodies". That's the term they want you to use instead of the more descriptive QUANGO (QUasi Autonomous Non-Governmental Organisation). We consider the 'organisation' (that includes the Honours and Decorations Committee) that collectively produced the discredited PJM recommendation to be a QUANGO. So, in our view, this evidence on a constitutional problem, points a finger at the workings of 'organisations' such as HD Committee.

Anyway, here is David's evidence:

http://www.fight4thepjm.org/documents/blunkett_to_GA_110706_2.jpg
http://www.fight4thepjm.org/documents/blunkett_to_GA_110706_3.jpg
http://www.fight4thepjm.org/documents/blunkett_to_GA_110706_4.jpg
http://www.fight4thepjm.org/documents/blunkett_to_GA_110706_5.jpg
http://www.fight4thepjm.org/documents/blunkett_to_GA_110706_6.jpg
http://www.fight4thepjm.org/documents/blunkett_to_GA_110706_7.jpg
http://www.fight4thepjm.org/documents/blunkett_to_GA_110706_8.jpg

If the text in the image is too small. write click the image and save it to your PC where you can enlarge it.


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BarryF, who fought for the Right to Wear the Pingat Jasa Malaysia

BarryF wrote:

We are not about to get pompous about civil servants and the PJM - but we are not the only ones to be worried about the power that civil servants wield in our supposed democracy.

I'm worried. I want to know whether those civil servants have exercised their power lawfully and democratically and with "due regard to facts rather than myths". We have to examine how much of the rules are drafted by civil servants. Those rules seem to suddenly appear as if etched in granite. Rules that have never been debated. Rules that "perpetuate myths". Rules that "govern your rights".

The civil sevants have caused to be issued an edict that says we must not wear our PJM. Most of us are civilians and not governed by any uniform rules. Therefore in my opinion that edict they have issued directly restricts our civil liberties. You are not being pompous. This is important to all of us. We have been awarded a medal and as far as I am aware the awarding country, Malaysia, did not place any restrictions on us wearing it. They want us to wear the medal with honour and it is being proudly worn in all countries EXCEPT by British citizens.

I want to know if their 'edict' that prohibits me wearing me PJM (when I get it!) is lawful. I know it's not fair and I know it was created by them to stop us having some pride about what we did. But was it lawful and based upon the truth and are you going to challenge this aspect as well?

BarryF wrote:

Please note that he makes reference to "non-Department Public Bodies". That's the term they want you to use instead of the more descriptive QUANGO (QUasi Autonomous Non-Governmental Organisation).

And QUANGOs have been under the microscope as well!

Have a look at the Research Paper from the Commons Library "The Quango Debate" at http://www.parliament.uk/commons/lib/research/rp2005/rp05-030.pdf


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BarryF, who fought for the Right to Wear the Pingat Jasa Malaysia

Eddie Barker wrote:

But was it lawful and based upon the truth and are you going to challenge this aspect as well?

Welcome to the Forum, Eddie.

We do not think the prohibition on British citizens, civilians, is lawful.

We know it was not based upon the truth.

And, yes, we shall challenge this aspect. Actually, that is exactly what we are doing on this forum and in our letters and our Rebuttal. But if we do not win a review and the right to wear the medal, the edict may have to be challenged elsewhere.

All the best,

Barry


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BarryF, who fought for the Right to Wear the Pingat Jasa Malaysia

BarryF wrote:

we now know that this PJM recommendation emerged from the desks of three key civil servants:

1. Mr Denis Brennan is the key civil servant. He is the Ceremonial Officer of the Cabinet Office (Secretary) and is pivotal in all this.

2. Then there Chris Edge who is the Honours Secretary at the Foreign and Commonwealth Office (who are ultimately responsible for Foreign awards). He will draft most of the letters you receive no matter who apparently signs them.

3. Then there is Richard Coney who drafts just about everything that emerges on the subject from the Ministry of Defence.

Just spotted a psot from George no-ralation Fleming on another section of the Forum. He includes four very useful email addresses He writes:

"Re: Parliament's 76 day holiday.

One point all veterans should take note of is that all MPs and ministers & shadow ministers of HMG are now on summer recess for nearly three months. Writing to them may not receive any attention for three months at the least.

However all MOD & FCO civil servants and those non elected members of the HD committee only have a three week holiday and should be back at their desks by the end of August.

To keep the fight for the right to wear the PJM medal ticking over and not let it go stale until elected ministers return to Parliament in October and we hope former veterans minister Don Touhig's proposal for a review to the medalwearing rules will be taken up, these four civil servants who are right at the center of the PJM medal issue can be contacted at the following e/mail addresses.

chris.edge@fco.gov.uk Chris Edge Honours Secretary to Sir Michael jay FCO

richard.coney506@mod.uk Richard Coney Honours 1 secretary to Rear Adm Wilkinson MOD

michael.jay@fco.gov.uk, Sir Michael Jay FCO representative on HD committee

denis.brennan@cabinet-office.x.gsi.gov.uk Denis Brennan Secretary HD committee Cabinet office"

We hope you will forward them the occasional billet doux!

Barry


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BarryF, who fought for the Right to Wear the Pingat Jasa Malaysia

BarryF wrote:

chris.edge@fco.gov.uk Chris Edge Honours Secretary to Sir Michael jay FCO

richard.coney506@mod.uk Richard Coney Honours 1 secretary to Rear Adm Wilkinson MOD

michael.jay@fco.gov.uk, Sir Michael Jay FCO representative on HD committee

denis.brennan@cabinet-office.x.gsi.gov.uk Denis Brennan Secretary HD committee Cabinet office"

We hope you will forward them the occasional billet doux!

If you do want to write to these civil servants - or anybody in our Basic PJM Address List at http://www.fight4thepjm.org/lobby_snailmail.htm - please feel free to use any part of any letter or post on this web site. There are literally hundreds of examples of what to write. And we're just about to publish some more.

Plagiarism has its place in this world! You do not have to have an original thought to warrant writing to these people. So long as you sincerely believe what you are writing, it matters not if you use other people's words to express your opinion. And it doesn't matter a hoot if the same opinion has beeen expressed hundreds of times before.

Go for it!


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BarryF, who fought for the Right to Wear the Pingat Jasa Malaysia

I have sent this to the addresses mentioned above, if you wish to do the same please feel free using part or all of the text, these Civil Servants are batting on a sticky wicket here!


Mr Chris Edge Foreign & Commonwealth Office (OR OTHER ADDRESSEES)

Dear Mr Edge (DITTO OTHER ADDRESSEES)

I am soon to be awarded The Pingat Jasa Malaysia Medal by the Government of Malaysia. The department I am addressing this letter to has denied me my rights to wear this medal as a civilian via Her Majesty The Queen, can you please inform me what my rights of appeal are against this, in my opinion, unfair decision.

I am not representing a group of people here, it is an individual request by myself, there are laws in the UK and the EC giving me the right to appeal, please advise me of my statutory rights.

If for any reason your department cannot answer this question, would you please forward this on to someone who can with the courtesy of a reply

cc Sir Michael Lord, MP Deputy Speaker of The House Of Commons (USE YOUR OWN MPs NAME HERE)

Yours sincerely

John Cooper

INCLUDE YOUR HOME ADDRESS OTHERWISE THEY DO NOT HAVE TO REPLY!


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HD Committee: Amateurs in a Professional World
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An automated response from Denis Brennans office to my email, so if anyone wishes to speak Ms Pengelli personally here is her phone number

Printable View This message is not flagged. [ Flag Message - Mark as Unread ]

Subject: Out of Office AutoReply: The Pingat Jasa Malaysia Medal
Date: Sun, 6 Aug 2006 09:16:46 +0100
From: denis.brennan@cabinet-office.x.gsi.gov.uk Add to Address Book
To: johncooper

I am away from the office until 14 August.
Eleri Pengelly is responsible for the work of the Secretariat. She can
be reached on 020 7276 2773.
Your mail is being forwarded to her.


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HD Committee: Amateurs in a Professional World
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I know this article was written a little while ago re The Arctic Convoy Medal well it is the same guy meddling in our medal

http://www.portsmouthtoday.co.uk/mk4custompages/CustomPage.aspx?PageID=43131


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HD Committee: Amateurs in a Professional World
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Re above, same guy, different newspaper

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2002/08/07/nvets07.xml&sSheet=/news/2002/08/07/ixnewstop.html


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HD Committee: Amateurs in a Professional World
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John Cooper wrote:

I know this article was written a little while ago re The Arctic Convoy Medal well it is the same guy meddling in our medal

http://www.portsmouthtoday.co.uk/mk4custompages/CustomPage.aspx?PageID=43131

John,

In my humble opinion you have stumbled, or otherwise, upon a minefield of brilliant information.
See SEVEN MYTHS OF THE MEN FROM THE MINISTRY. WHAT THEY ARE DOING IS NOT LAWFUL AND THEY WERE EVEN ACTING THAT WAY WITH THE ARTIC STAR IN 2004.

By design Andy, all you had to do was put into a Google Search Engine RC, WALLAH!


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HD Committee: Amateurs in a Professional World
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George...........I was just waiting for you to come along and confirm that CHESTNUT!!!!!!!!

That is why I have kept a low profile on this subject, the cordite still hasn't hit the fan yet, but it is about to



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HD Committee: Amateurs in a Professional World
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George is the Artic Star an emblem or a medal with ribbon like all the rest. I read what you posted and it seems that they did the dirty by not issuing a medal, only an emblem, but again I could be wrong as this possibly is what it was in the first place. Andy.